Author Topic: Tyres  (Read 12959 times)

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Offline Sirdeuce

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Tyres
« on: August 18, 2010, 11:43:11 AM »
This one is basically for Bryan. I haven't looked at tires in about 4 years. Last set I bought for my MR2 was Yokohama AVS ES100. Grip was good, water shed was good. I didn't like the feel, sidewall seed too soft, felt sloppy to me. Wore the tires out in about a week of driving up and down this hill. Wear pattern suggested massive positive camber when I was running with 1.5 degrees of negative camber.  Outside showed belt threads, inside was basically untouched. Haven't had much good to say about Yokohama. Won't say much about what is on the Speed3 as we buy tires based on HER driving style, longevity, comfort, and price. But we have BFG g-Force Super Sport a/s 225/40 ZR18 on it. Not a bad tire, wet or dry.
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline BryanH

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #1 on: August 18, 2010, 12:26:56 PM »
Tyres, eh?  I bet you call them "Kerbs," too.  :P

These days for our little cars, your choices are pretty limited.  At least you run the same size all around - I have to try to find staggered tires for the MK2 MR2s, and last I checked only two companies made tires in both sizes (or even close).  225/50/15s are unobtanium.  But anyway...

I echo your sentiments on the ES100s.  They were great in the wet, and rode really smooth, but the sidewalls were so sloppy they were awful to drive at the limit and wore out in no time.  Here's what mine looked like after a day at Buttonwillow:



They turned blue from the heat...

What tire size(s) would work for you?  What are you looking for in a tire?  I usually do all my searching at TireRack and then also Discount Tire Direct online because they carry a few brands TireRack doesn't. 

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #2 on: August 18, 2010, 08:16:51 PM »
I would like to run 15's, but finding cheap, relatively light rims is pretty hard with the funds we're running on. Trying to go light on the car, so a 205- 215/55 14, or 205/50 15 should suffice. I had pretty decent handling on my 2 with 195/55 14's. But since we are going to push hard all the time, and some of us aren't used to the 2's, I think the added meat would be a good direction to go. We're not too limited on tire type so my first choice would be a Falken Azenis, or the like.  My first set of 15's were the Yokomamas at 205/50 15. Too bad they wore like cheddar cheese. Blew the clutch out and haven't had her on the road since.
Whaaaht, kerb ain't raht? C'mon, y'allr kiddin'.
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline BryanH

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #3 on: August 18, 2010, 10:54:52 PM »
Oh this is for the LeMons car?  I thought it was for your personal car.  Well I would say Azenis or Dunlop Z1 Star Specs off the top of my head.  Will have to find out what else is in 14-15" sizes tomorrow.  Bridgestone's RE-11 should be the longest lasting and most predictable of the super sticky street tires... that's why they cost more.

Offline BigMike

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #4 on: August 18, 2010, 10:56:28 PM »
Bryan, do the choices for 13" rims get any better?

If we want a set of cheap tires that are decent, take a look at what I've got on both my MR2 and my Infiniti: General Altimax HP



I am running 195x60x14. They certainly are no match to my old 225x50x15 (unobtainum you say huh... dang :() Potenza S03 Pole Position tires, but they only cost me $55 each! I was looking at the Potenza RE960AS Pole Position, but they are nearly $100 more for the set and out of stock until December :o

Comparing the Altimax HP's to the cheapest tire in this size, the Bridgestone/Fuzion HRi, it's a no brainer. The HRis sell for $50 each, but look at the comparisons:

Tire Rack Comparison:
Wet   Dry   Treadwear   Price
RE960AS8.99.18.6$75-ish
Altimax HP  8.89.08.3$55-ish
HRi7.98.57.9$50-ish

1 set of the Altimax HPs was barely over $200. Not bad for only being 1-tenth difference in handling, but of course the treadwear is pretty important to us, but not sure if that justifies 100 more bucks.
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Offline BigMike

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #5 on: August 18, 2010, 11:00:56 PM »
I am just thinking that we could bring maybe 3 sets of tires (how many sets do we need?): two sets of cheap tires and 1 set of better tires. Run both cheaper tires on Sat and Sun morning (higher treadwear so they can last this long maybe?), and then slap the final better set of tires on to finish strong?
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Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #6 on: August 18, 2010, 11:28:40 PM »
I'm thinking we need 4 sets of tires. 1 set for the beginning of the race. Medium treadwear. First set to get through the familiarization period. As we learn the track and push harder, move up to a stickier tire. Oh yeah, when the race(?) starts we'll have a full field, it'll be slower. As cars die, people have accidents etc. the the track should open up a bit. 2 sets of stickier sports/performance tires. 1 set to run if it decides to go south on the weather. Something with a deep, fast shedding tread. Hey Bryan! Do they still make those AVS tires?
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline BryanH

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #7 on: August 22, 2010, 02:00:21 PM »
Bryan, do the choices for 13" rims get any better?
Not for street tires.  In 13-15" sizes, these days it's far easier to find race tires than streets. 

Just did a bit of looking at TireRack and Tires.com

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Hankook&tireModel=Ventus+R-S3&partnum=245WR5Z222
These are hot stuff.  It's one of the top 2 or 3 street tires for autox and it likes heat, unlike some other top autox tires that need to be cooled after a 60-second run.  So it'd probably make a good track tire.  Autoxers have been known to get hundreds of runs from the RS-3.  It's wide and short.  Might be tough to get them up front on an AW11 without either running low offset wheels and radiusing the fenders, or using coilovers instead of the stock strut bodies.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Dunlop&tireModel=Direzza+Sport+Z1+Star+Spec&partnum=05VR5Z1SS
These have been around a couple years and are a proven great versatile tire.  Great in the wet, good on heavy cars too so they can take some abuse.  This one is also available in a 195/60/14.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Kumho&tireModel=Ecsta+XS&partnum=05WR5EXS
These are cheaper and not far behind the top street tires.  I don't remember if they like heat or hate it.  It's supposed to be a great tire but not too many autoxers run it for some reason. 

http://www.tirerack.com/tires/tires.jsp?tireMake=Bridgestone&tireModel=Potenza+RE-11&sidewall=Blackwall&partnum=05VR5RE11
The aforementioned Bridgies.  Right up there with the Hankooks and Dunlops.  I know little about these tires specifically - the predecessor, the RE-01R, lasted forever.

Actually I didn't find anything in my searches at Tires.com.  The Azenis is no longer available?

I'm assuming that 140 treadwear is OK... most of the tires above are at the limit for legality in street tire autocross classes.

Offline BigMike

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2010, 12:33:09 PM »
I'm assuming that 140 treadwear is OK... most of the tires above are at the limit for legality in street tire autocross classes.

From http://www.24hoursoflemons.com/pricesandrules.aspx,

2.3: Tire Eligibility: DOT-approved street tires only, minimum treadwear rating 190; no exceptions. Blanco Basura, this means you.
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     My 1987 Supercharged 4A-powered 6-speed MR2

Offline BigMike

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2010, 12:34:21 PM »
Those Direzza Sport Z1 Star Specs look GREAT :D
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Offline BryanH

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #10 on: August 25, 2010, 03:01:51 PM »
Heh.  Silly treadwear ratings.  Tire manufacturers can put whatever numbers they want on a tire.

With 190 TW minimum, it's gotta be the Z1 Star Specs for maximum grip.

Offline BigMike

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2010, 02:51:34 PM »
Bryan,

It looks like we might get a free set of 15x8" wheels. In this case, we could run 205x50x15. Are our choices better in this size??
-/_/___/__________\___\_\-
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```````````````````````       
R135
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  246

     My 1987 Supercharged 4A-powered 6-speed MR2

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2010, 07:00:56 PM »
What did the 15x8s come from? What is the offset? Might have a fitment problem.
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline BryanH

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #13 on: September 02, 2010, 01:28:15 PM »
15x8s will be a big challenge up front.  A 15x7 is a snug fit if you want to keep it within the fenders. 

It looks like the Z1 is the grippiest tire >190 treadwear so if it's available in a 205/50/15 or so it's still the best bet.  There should be a few more choices in general for 15s though.

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: Tyres
« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2010, 02:09:21 PM »
Put the 8s in the back Get 7s for the front? How do you think the fitmkent will be if we roll the fender beads?
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."