Author Topic: The engine......  (Read 5471 times)

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Offline Sirdeuce

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The engine......
« on: February 11, 2010, 11:13:36 AM »
Looking at a few things. I'm back to wanting to build with the early crank and rods. The early crank weighs 11.7 kilos (25.8 lbs), the early 11 kilos (24.25 lbs). That's 700 grams (1.55 lbs) not having to be spun. The early rods weigh in a whopping 459 grams (1 lb). The late model high comp rods weigh in at 526 grams(1.16 lb). 20 valve is 514 grams(1.13 lb). Just for comparison, the atlantic rods weigh in at 454 grams. The early rods are around 2.5 oz lighter, but combined are a whole 10 oz lighter. The pistons weights are close enough to not worry about. The weight savings are a little over 2 lbs on the recip assy. alone. the stock 200mm flywheel weigh 16 lbs. The flywheel I have sitting in storage weighs 9 lbs. Total savings of 11 lbs(engine and flywheel). that saves up like 15 lbs of torque during acceleration.
I would consider a compression ratio of up to 11-1. The fuel available at the track has a 100r octane rating. Motor octane rating is 96. We can get away with 10.5-1 on the street with the 91r crap we get on the street.
The cylinder head should be the small port. The t-vis is great for improving the torque below 5000 rpm but I'm sure we'll spend enough time above that not to worry. Besides, the small port has a decent low engine speed flow, we won't give up anything really. I have an oversized throttle body on the corolla now. Ask Mikey if it makes a difference, he should know.
Cams, I have WEBCAM grind #294, 246 duration 8.2 lift, or 264 dur 7.9, 8.1, 8.35 lifts, also stock cams.
The stock exhaust manifold is sufficient for a decent output, but I do have a set of headers available to us.
We just need to build a good exhaust system. NO CAT! NO SMOG EQUIPMENT!
I have several different injector flow rates available. This will be good for tuning. I would like to use the JDM MAP type ECU, I do have one available. Just need to get a couple of sensors and mod the harness. Mostly just a repin job.
Need to find an underdrive pully........CHEAP.
« Last Edit: February 11, 2010, 11:43:46 AM by Sirdeuce »
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2010, 08:52:08 PM »
The suggestion has come in to keep the engine as it is in the MR2 currently, with mild mods. Alright, the stock MAP 4AGE puts out a rated 120hp, 105lbft of tourque. The AFM model lolsoes a little with the U.S. smog equipment, coming in at 115hpand 98lbft of tourque. If we use the headers that came in the car, no cat, high flowing muffler, with a low restriction intake, we should come close to the stock MAP ratings if not slightly better. Fine tune with injectors and AFM adjustments, maybe mild cams(WEBCAMS 294 grind as we already have), we could be pushing 130hp and up to 115lbft of torque. Reliability shouldn't drop off at all. I'm sure everyone knows by now how I like to play with the powerplant, but I like this idea.  Be a good start for the first time out. All in agreement?
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline kdogae86

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #2 on: April 23, 2010, 10:02:33 PM »
yeah i agree, lets just get through this first race. unless an engine can be built in the next month and tested

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #3 on: April 24, 2010, 09:08:07 AM »
The headers may be a bit of overkill at this level. I have a couple JDM manifolds we could use instead. Might even be easier to make a short exhaust.
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #4 on: April 24, 2010, 10:26:52 AM »
Should still improve the oil return.
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline BigMike

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #5 on: April 24, 2010, 03:45:19 PM »
pushing 130hp and up to 115lbft of torque. Reliability shouldn't drop off at all.

I completely agree to this. Let's go conservative for this first race since we don't know what we're getting into nor going up against. Then prepare a 150 HP engine for the March 2011 event.

Also, remember that if I can get an intake cam built that works then our power band will be much wider than stock so the engine will have more usable torque.

Mike
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Offline BigMike

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2010, 03:45:48 PM »
Should still improve the oil return.

Completely agree.
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Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2010, 08:44:50 PM »
If you get the cam gear done, and it widens the torque band, would the close ratio tranny be a good way to go?
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline BigMike

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2010, 01:17:32 AM »
A broader torque band would allow for longer ratio gearing, but if we have a 6-speed at our disposal, why not use it? We can pick up Pontiac Vibe 6-spd transaxles with a broken bellhousing for around $200, and since this is an internal mod, sight unseen = it won't count against our $500.
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     My 1987 Supercharged 4A-powered 6-speed MR2

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2010, 09:52:35 AM »
build it, we'll try it. we can change cams if necesary.
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2010, 07:28:57 PM »
Ok, first time out. Stock intake and exhaust. Just improve the oil return an quantity. WEBCAMS #294. Maybe the big TB I have.  Then if we decide to go at it again, we go hog nuts on the engine.
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline BigMike

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #11 on: April 27, 2010, 01:12:35 PM »
Ok, first time out. Stock intake and exhaust. Just improve the oil return an quantity. WEBCAMS #294. Maybe the big TB I have.  Then if we decide to go at it again, we go hog nuts on the engine.
Sounds good :D

Bill,

I am sorry if I am coming across as negative over this whole project. I'm not trying to step on toes I am just worried about taking it too seriously at first. After talking to Brad and listening to his experience, he said he was passing people with a 70 HP Tercel even...

I am not sure if 110-130 HP will get us a 1st place finish, but I am trying to change my opinion to not worry so much about this. I feel that we will learn a lot and will have much better chances at winning in March 2011. Remember there is the MR2 Cup we can get first place in even if we don't get first place overall :)

Maybe I am being too hot and too cold. In the "let's not be coy about our engine" thread I was ready to stuff a Supercharger in there and now here I am happy with 110 HP. Maybe I'm not focusing on this enough while in school? Maybe I'll change my opinion over the summer when I get my MR2 running and I get that *spark* and that *excitement* back in my blood. I've had a "Need for Speed" deficiency since 2004!! I feel like I am Ricky Bobby and I gotta jump in my MR2 with a cougar in it. Seriously! I'm sure its funny to you but I've been out of anything fast for 6 freak'n years!! I can't WAIT to get my car back and take her up Mammoth Pools, Old Tollhouse, etcetera. I keep dreaming about it and I don't want to do any school work, I just want to work on my car but I gotta wait :(

I'm just saying that I am sorry if I am being to pushy or inconsistent over this whole thing. I just want to have fun with all you guys and I think if we just get accepted and participate in the event, the rest will be inevitable and will all follow suit.

Regards,
BigMike
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|______________________|
|-------\___________/------|
```````````````````````       
R135
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  246

     My 1987 Supercharged 4A-powered 6-speed MR2

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #12 on: April 27, 2010, 03:02:05 PM »
No apologies, I'm having fun with this! Hot or cold, believe it or not, I really never had any delusions of grandeur expecting to win a race first time out. Just trying to get the proper focus on how to go with the engine. Ain't steppin' on my toes brah. Hell, the less we do now, the less stress I have over it. I AM BROOOOKE!! But under the circumstances, I want to give you a huge thanks! This whole thing has kept me sane for the past few months. Especially the last couple of weeks (see Story Ideas). I'm still going to bounce ideas around this forum. Oh yeah, The engine is going to be close to the 120-130 range either way. Going to be hard to make it less than that. SORRY
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."

Offline kdogae86

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #13 on: May 03, 2010, 04:30:06 PM »
i think with cams and intake just to get the engine a little quicker is fine. right now lets just try to get the chassis
built and dialed in than power can come later.

Offline Sirdeuce

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Re: The engine......
« Reply #14 on: May 03, 2010, 07:36:21 PM »
rightio
"I slept with faith and found a corpse in my arms on wakening; I drank and danced all night with doubt and found her a virgin in the morning."